Renewable Energy Ballot Question a Step Too Far, Farmington Hills Officials Say
Take our poll: Will you vote for Proposal 3, which aims at getting 25 percent of Michigan's energy from renewable resources by 2025?
While Farmington Hills city council members generally support the idea of increasing Michigan's use of renewable energy, they'd rather not see a goal of 25 percent by 2025 enshrined in the state's constitution.
"I like the idea of renewable energy, I'm just not sure this is the way to get there," council member Ken Massey said at a study session Monday.
Officials learned more about the ballot proposal from Hugh McDiarmid, Jr., a Farmington resident and communications director with the Michigan Environmental Council (MEC). He said the ballot question came about because the state legislature has had no interest in the proposal.
"The only movement in the legislature is to repeal the 2008 law," McDiarmid said, referring to a requirement for 10 percent renewable energy by 2015.
Council member Nancy Bates said the state should wait to see whether that goal is reached, before increasing the standard. McDiarmid said that leaves "job creators" in the renewable energy industry are "in limbo".
"If we wait until 2015, we're sort of on the edge of a cliff," he said.
Fuel costs affect imported coal
McDiarmid said the state currently gets about 60 percent of its energy from coal, which has to be imported from other states. As a result, the cost of coal is affected by the price of motor fuel and has increased 71 percent over the last four years.
Ballot proposal 3, McDiarmid said, would define renewable power and set standards for where facilities can be located. It also sets a rate cap, so that if the cost of implementing the higher goal is greater than anticipated, utility companies will have a longer period of time to make it happen.
He said the proposal would result in lower levels of pollutants, provide good jobs and help keep energy rates more predictable. "We spend $1.5 billion to import coal, and all that money is lost to our economy," McDiarmid said. "We'd like to take some of that money and keep it in our economy."
He said the cost of implementing the 2008 legislation has been "considerably lower than even the most ardent opponents predicted." McDiarmid also acknowledged that while increasing renewable energy can be cost-effective for rate payers, stockholders get more out of incentives for making capital investments, like power plants.
"We are working on how to reward the utilities (for increasing renewable energy investment)," he said.
Bates said she has heard changes coming to the renewable energy industry will make it more expensive.
"The thing I still struggle with is ... amending the state constitution," council member Randy Bruce said. "I just hate to legislate through the constitution, even though I think a lot of stuff in here is great."
"There's major issues with these technologies," Massey said. "Otherwise, companies would be flourishing, rather than ... imploding and becoming untenable. You're trying to force this through constitutional change. I'm very uncomfortable with that."
McDiarmid offered to have the MEC's "policy wonks" address some of the questions officials raised in an email that he would forward to city manager Steve Brock, for distribution to the council.
Additional information about the ballot proposal is available at mienergymijobs.com.
Mary Burck
8:35 am on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
where are the leaders in this world?
Tanya
9:27 am on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
If I am not mistaken, they had wind mills, well pumps, etc, only a few years ago. Our grandparents were smarter than us!?! Or, are we to spoiled to go and actually work for what we are using, outside! It is so easy to sit on the coach, watch TV, in the air, watching the food grow in your fridge! Michigan is the 5th fattest state!! That should open some eyes!
TURN OFF YOUR TV'S!! That just saved both energy and your waist line!
Sue Burstein
9:59 am on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
@Tanya- a fews years ago (well pumps, wind mills) we used outhouses, drank unsafe water, and generally died at an early age from diseases that have been eradicated in the past 50 years (think polio). But, hey, you are free to go back to that kind of life, just don't expect the rest of us to do that too. I happen to like my TV, my iPad, and the comforts I have earned. In fact, most obesity occurs in low income populations...perhaps there are other factors at work there.
Jimbo
10:57 am on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
If the people lead the leaders will follow. Six other states already have a 25 by 25 law, even West VIRGINIA has a strong alternative law. This law would have a tremendous impact on southeast Michigan because that's where much of the industry that will develop under it will prosper. We have more engineers per capita here then anywhere else in America. We were once the arsenal for democracy, now we need to be the arsenal for alternative energy and climate change. This is not about going backwards. This is about going forward. We either can lead the newto technologies or we will be followers in the future.
Jimbo
11:13 am on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
Our own city is a leader in environmental protection, energy conservation and alternative energy, all the things that this proposal will support. Iowa already gets 23% of its energy from wind/solar. It is becoming harder every day to deny the planet is getting warmer, that coal is too dirty and that we need to get away from fossel fuels. New developments are giving us clear window solar panels, new hydro-power systems from sewage flow and important energy efficient products are coming on the market every day. We can do this. We just have to get the powerful interests who support the current model to get out of the way. The 25 by 25 proposal allows the people to lead, we need to to help that happen.
John Doe
4:14 pm on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
I want to know why people think all these new technologies will be manufactured here? Where are the majority of solar panels being manufactured right now? Answer, CHINA! How will that change if we pass this Constitutional amendment? If it costs too much right now to manufacture gears and bearings and other mechanical parts in MI for windmills, why do you think that will suddenly change once this thing passes? They will all STILL be produced in some other far off cheap labor country, unless of course you expect this proposal will lower labor costs so much by the sheer lose of jobs in MI that then our relative state of poverty will lower our pay rates to be competitive with Indonesia, China and Mexico. Vote Yes on 3, Kill Michigan's future.
John Doe
4:32 pm on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
If this Amendment passes, get ready to see what few manufacturing jobs left int he state leave. Its as simple as that. Do they build solar panels at factories fueled by solar? Do they build windmills fueled by wind turbines? Im sure a percentage does, but nowhere near 25% of the energy consumed in thier production comes from the same sources they are producing. Can anybody imagine the Rouge Steel plant smelting giant iron pots with wind and solar? Only fools who have no concept of the massive number of BTUs needed for such an operation would think so.
One last point, if importing coal is bad, wouldnt then the exporting of our cars be bad too? If its wrong for us to bring in goods from other states then it must be just as bad for them to bring our products into their states! Do none of you understand the very simplest of concepts behind basic COMMERCE?!
MPH
8:40 pm on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
We as a country need to stop our dependent needs and look to produce for ourselves. Wind, solar, geo are all no brainers. Our neighbors in Ontario seem to understand and use wind farms all along the lakes. Why are we so far behind? Look at this site; http://www.canwea.ca
The site shows hundreds of wind farms using companies from all over the world including the USA labor force. Our past govenor tried in vain to get Vestas Wind to reopen numerous closed plants in Michigan. Please vote yes so we can stop being behind and use our work force and open new plants in America.
John Doe
10:08 pm on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
We as a country have more coal than any other in the world. If we are to be independent, use the coal. Your argument is absolutely nothing more than the typical mindless liberal regurgitate. You think its brilliant, you have heard other so called really really smart people say it. But if you actually thought about in context, you would have to conclude it is just RIDICULOUS!
Tanya
9:59 pm on Wednesday, September 26, 2012
@ Sue-
Sorry but being fat has no $ value! I can go into the "rich" area's and see fat people!
You are a typical consumer that needs MORE!
DTE has the monopoly! And, your to stubborn to realize your the reason they are so powerful. Look at their building downtown- they are all solar-paneled! Try to get one on your personal house!
Oh, people today are living longer due to medicine! Making someone else RICH!
Hugh McDiarmid, Jr.
11:38 am on Thursday, September 27, 2012
More than 240 Michigan companies are engaged in the wind and solar supply chains alone. A Michigan 25x25 would provide work for those companies, but also send the message that Michigan is open for manufacturing business in this sector of the economy. An Eaton Rapids company has developed a process for machining wind turbine hubs that is so cutting edge that the Chinese are shipping hubs there to be machined. We're already making components for renewable energy systems. I do not share Anonymous for Obvious Reasons (not obvious to me, why not stand up!) fearful outlook that we shouldn't move forward because we can't compete with China.
John Doe
6:11 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
we can compete with China when or labor costs meet theirs. Are you willing to work for 1$ and hour with no benefits and no safety nets? Honestly, you know the premise of the question is 100% accurate. Forward ho Hugh.
FHVoice
2:50 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Coal is already losing in the cost battle. We have a glut of natural gas, which is less expensive. The question is really no longer an argument between coal and alternate energies.
marilyn lennis
1:13 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
I'm voting for the proposal. We need to have this goal! I was reading that one wind generator can provide enough electricity for 600 homes (1000 homes in Canada, I guess they use less electricity than us) . The wind generator combined with solar power is a great combination for our region, in that when it's cloudy the wind generators will supply the electricity. If its calm & sunny the solar panels generate the electricity. I imagine if it's sunny & windy both will be generating. I guess you could call it a "hybrid" system.
I believe we need this goal of 25% by 2025 in order to reach beyond our coal, oil & natural gas sources of power. As we all know these sources are finite and generate pollutants & CArbon Dioxide.
marilyn lennis
1:17 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
Question: Why is "Anon for obvious reasons" remaining anonymous? If you have such strong views, you could stand behind them with at least a name! Anonymous views are generally discounted by other readers.
John Doe
6:14 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
So people cant go look up pictures of me at Kettle Point sipping coffee with a big goofy bow on head and a matching grin on my face. What else is there I can dig up?
John Doe
2:37 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
Marilyn Lennis, just punch that name into google, see what a little curiosity can provide in just five minutes for no money invested at all. If I go sign up to any number of pay sites, 20$ a month maybe, I won't even begin to shock with what is available on you or any name and rudimentary locale. So, I am Anon for obvious reason, bravery is not the same as stupidity, thank you.
John Doe
5:58 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
Here is one more perspective for supporters of this Constitutional Amendment to consider. This is now going to give Govt Mandate to tell private business, yes our power producers and distributes are private businesses, how they can run their companies and how they are to provide their products, again as a Constitutional Amendment. Lets just change the entity being regulated a bit, not much, just a bit. Lets now say the Govt passes a mandate that all Private Citizens to produce 25% of their electricity via "green" means. That now means that every single home and business is responsible to meet the same exact goal as what is being asked on this ballot. If you, yes you personally, are now required to install thousands, if not tens of thousands of dollars in equipment onto your home to meet this mandate, wouldn't you feel a bit imposed upon? Dont you think it would negatively impact the general economy as all these dollars are sucked out into purchasing this "green" hardware rather than say, cars? Whether DTE or MichCon or whomever has to pay for or you directly have to pay for it, it has to be paid for. Why not force all citizens and residents just pay for it directly rather than indirectly? Its a moral question and the morality of it changes neither way you look at it.
John Doe
6:03 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
I still ask one simple question, How many solar panels and windmills will it take to smelt just one pot of iron at the Rouge Steel Plant? While you think about the absurdity of the answer, realize that yes indeed this Constitutional Amendment will certainly damage job creation and the general economy of this state.
One other question, Given china is the number one producer of solar panels and windmills in the world, why would they chose to move a single job to MI when it is already admitted this Constitutional Amendment is going to drive up energy costs thus causing any production costs of this green hardware up? If its already economically infeasible to manufacture those things here, why will it be more feasible AFTER you drive the costs of production up even further?
I know, I know, Im sorry to confuse you with the facts.
John Doe
6:06 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
And one last thing, just for marilyn lennis and the others who dont understand history and politics and the targeting of dissidents against expansive centralized govt power, and yes, it can and does happen right here in America, I am giving you a name to call me by since you seem to care more about the messenger than careful consideration of the actual message.